to the deling pod with me James deling poll and I know I always say I'm excited
about this week's special guest but before we meet him let's have a word from
one of our sponsors you may have noticed that gold has been doing pretty well
recently in the last year I think it's increased in value in sterling terms
by around 50% and if you'd bought gold when I first started recommending it
on that on adverts like this you would have certainly more than doubled your
money now a lot of you are probably thinking is it too late have I missed the
boat well I can't definitively answer that question nobody can but if I had to
guess I would say gold has got some way to go and yeah sure there's going to be
corrections but you really ought to be owning physical gold for lots and lots
not paper gold obviously you should be owning physical gold now there were two
ways of owning gold either you can actually own it keep it in a vault or in
your own home there are risks obviously with keeping it in your own home you
know what if burb does come whatever the problem with keeping it in a vault is
that you then get paid a storage fee but there was another way of owning
physical gold and actually getting paid interest on it unusually and that
is for the company that I've I've recommended before and I use them
myself they're called monetary metals monetary metals lets you earn a yield on
your gold paid in gold right now you can earn up to 4% annual yield paid in
physical gold ounces not dollars or pounds instead of just storing gold and
paying vault fees your gold actually earns more gold over time
monetary metals connects gold owners with real productive businesses like
refiners or jewellers that lease the gold that's how they can pay interest by
the way so so they lease the gold and they pay yields back in gold this is a
way to compound your wealth in ounces of gold there are no storage or
insurance fees charged while your metal is earning yield you can open an
account with 10 ounces of gold and start earning yield right away you
stay in control deploy how much of your gold you want into lease
opportunities in today's inflationary environment saving in paper currency
means losing purchasing power earning in gold means growing your real wealth go
to the link in the description below or go to monetary that's m o n e t a r y
hyphen metals dot com forward slash deling poll forward slash to learn
more about how to participate and start earning a return on honest money again
with monetary metals
welcome to the deling pod Nick Bryant you're you're in a European time zone
well I live in New York City but I try to be ubiquitous so here I am oh OK OK OK
so tell us about yourself before we go on you're American I am American
born and raised in the Midwest and I am a writer I've been writing I've been a
professional writer for 35 years and a lot of my writing has focused on lower
socioeconomic children in the United States of America I've written a book
about the hurdles lower socioeconomic children face in the United States I've
written a number of articles and then in 2002 2003 I kind of stumbled
across a nationwide child trafficking network that had been covered up and I
spent the next seven years writing a book on that called the Franklin scantle
a story of power brokers child abuse and betrayal and that was published in
about 209 to 10 and then I started to investigate Jeffrey Epstein in 2011
and what I found when I investigated Jeffrey Epstein was basically a carbon
copy of the Franklin scan and I this is back in 2011 when nobody even knew the
name Jeffrey Epstein so I actually acquired his black book in 2011 and I
would eventually acquire his flight logs but no one wanted to touch it in the
mainstream media no one and I sat on that till I sat on those things till
2015 and finally somebody was willing to publish it and we published the black
book and the flight logs in 2015 on Gawker which was eventually sued into
oblivion by one of Jeffrey Epstein's friends Peter Teal and there was we
were thinking of there'd be a bang but there was kind of a whimper and then
in 2019 Americans just weren't ready for what we had to say I think that was the
problem and then in 2019 after Jeffrey Epstein got arrested there was a renewed
interest in. So yeah, I'm dimly aware of the Franklin scantle and you can
tell me more about it but I've got to ask you how come you're still alive.
Well, people ask me that all the time. Yeah, I've had I've only had one
death threat. So what what for did that take how how how explicit was it? It
was the first. Okay, so the Franklin network, the epicenter of it was the
Omaha, Nebraska. That's where they got most of the kids, but they fly them
around the country but mostly to DC at a party house. That was right for
audiovisual blackmail much like Craig Spence or Jeffrey Epstein songs and it
was I'd been in Omaha for about seven or eight days asking questions talking to
various people that have been involved and on my last night and actually I
had an old friend that lived in Omaha and I was staying with him and then on the
last night a woman came to the door and told me I was in great danger and I
was going to get killed.
Did did did she feel like somebody he was friendly or was it was it concerned
or was it basically a warning? A threat?
I've got a magniliquent vocabulary and I've been a writer for 35 years but I
really would have a hard time describing her and what she came across as. She
was a very strange looking woman and someone that was definitely on the
spooky side. So I mean just taking a look at her would make you step her
back. So that was that was my first death threat and I'd investigate some
really heavy-duty stories in the past but that was my first death threat and I
was also followed there too when I was in Omaha. I caught someone following me
and in a car and then the Nebraska State Patrol which played an integral
role in covering this up starting to call my friend's house on a daily basis.
So that and then when I was talking to people that had been involved in
this there were some fairly high-profile deaths in this in the Franklin
scandal and when I was talking to people it was like I was talking to it was
like I was writing the expose on the KGB in Stalinist Russia. People in Omaha
were terrified to talk about this.
It's I mean I don't know how American listeners will feel about this but I
think most European viewers watching this will be going Omaha, Nebraska. It's
like it's like Boring'sville. Nothing ever happens there. Was there any
particular reason that this happened in Nebraska or was it happening
everywhere and you just happened to expose it then? Well I think it happens in
a lot of places Nebraska is different though. Strategic air command which is
the brain of the US defense is located at Stratcom which is just outside
Omaha. So there's an enormously high number of CIA personnel in the Omaha
area because of Stratcom. Right. And I believe and I think that law enforcement
is kind of hooked into that and I think that they keep pretty close tabs on
people that might encroach upon Stratcom. Right. Before you expose the
Franklin scandal, did you sort of believe more or less in the system or were you
always skeptical? My first major investigation, I'm from Minneapolis and it
was through the alternative weekly and there was a serial killer killing
prostitutes in Minneapolis and law enforcement denied that and I threw a
lot of investigation, a lot of work. I got the names of 38 mostly prostitutes
that had been stabbed strangled or beaten in the previous eight years and then I
brought it to the law enforcement and I said you still want to go on with this
story that there's no serial killer and then they became somewhat receptive
but then a task force was formed after that. So but I think had that
an article not come out, definitely without a doubt a task force wouldn't have
been formed and I also interviewed the former boss of the Lucchese crime
family, one of the five major crime families in the United States at the
Supermax prison in Florence, Colorado and he told me he was using NY to
highly decorated NYP detectives for hits and I started to investigate that and
the feds had said that he was a psychopath and that he was responsible for
36 homicides and he shouldn't ever be believed and just because someone's
psychopath it doesn't mean that they can't tell the truth. I mean they don't
have any compunction about lying but it doesn't mean that that precludes them
from telling the truth. So I started digging into that and I got an FBI
document about those cops doing hits and I accumulated other evidence and I
brought it back to the magazine that sent me out there and they said well
you know Nick these are highly decorated police officers and this guy's a
psychopath in prison for 10 life sentences but I said you know here's some
evidence that basically corroborates him and the magazine wouldn't go with it
and this was in 1999 and six years later those cops were indicted for doing
hits for this mob boss. So in two major investigative articles that I'd done I
had seen tremendous malfeasance in both state and federal law enforcement. This
on the other hand was difficult to grasp because the federal government and state
government were covering up a child trafficking network as we're seeing with
the Epstein case and if you cover up a crime you're abetting that crime and it
was hard for me initially to get my mind around that the federal government
would aid in a bad child trafficking. But and I went to Omaha the first time
very skeptical but then I came back from Omaha very very kind of
discombobulated I realized it was true and I mean I was freaked out about the
death threat and the other stuff but what freaked me out even more was that it
was true that there was this huge child trafficking network that was destroying
children one after the other and that had been covered up by state and federal
law enforcement I just I found that sign I thought that there would be a line in
the sand somewhere. And who was running this operation? The the pimp in DC was
named Lawrence King and the pimp in Washington DC was named Craig Spatz.
King oversaw he managed a credit union the Franklin credit union ergo the
Franklin scandal and Craig Spatz was a power broker in Washington DC who had a
mansion in a very upscale part of DC that was right through audiovisual blackmail
and he was also a CIA asset. And and I believe that he was blackmailing people
for the dark malignant corner of CIA that does that type of thing. So his
function was to collect Compromat and use use the truck of children. He had a
source for children but he primarily relied upon King to bring kids in. And where
did they find these what what what what numbers are we talking about here?
Hundreds. The Franklin network was operational for about 10 years.
And the Epstein network was operational for about 25 years. But I think that the
Franklin network was much bigger than the Epstein network. Right. I think in
totality they probably destroyed probably about the same number of children. But
the Franklin network was much bigger than the Jeff Epstein network. And
where are they getting these children?
Predators are they know how to pray. There was a there's a orphanage on the
outskirts of Omaha called Boys Town. It's probably the most iconic orphanage in the
world. They were plundering Boys Town for underage prostitutes. And they were also
plundering the foster care system. There was a foster care. There was someone who put
children in foster care homes that where they would be trafficked. And then kids just
fall between the cracks to run away kids. Kids that have no really latchkey kids whose parents
are busy don't really keep tabs on them. Those type of kids fall through the cracks
and they're scooped up to by networks like this.
Right. And these children but what ages?
The primarily Spence and King like pubescent boys. Just like Glenn Maxwell and Jeffrey
Epstein like pubescent girls. But if you wanted someone if you wanted a kid that was younger
they would get you a kid that was younger. And I've known that Epstein was trafficking
girls under the age of 12 for quite some time. And now because of the Epstein documents that have
come out we're seeing that that some of these kids were trafficked at a very young age.
Right. And so they're being used for prostitution obviously. I don't know if I
what I mean is that they're being they're being used to provide sexual favors for
yes. But but presumably some of the for some of these poor kids it's much worse than that.
They're basically being sold to be to be killed by people to get their kicks out of it or to
be killed for satanic ritual purposes. There was an occult dimension of the Franklin scandal.
And there were extremely sadistic pedophiles with the Epstein scandal. I've also known about
extremely sadistic pedophiles. And now we're getting accounts of victims alleged victims
that were possibly killed. But I should say that those accounts aren't very solid. They're
has declared that only Jeffrey Epstein and Glenn Maxwell acted alone. They had no co-conspirators.
So the government hasn't been inclined to investigate any of the documentation that's
been given to them that that hundreds of thousands of documents. I want to come on to Epstein in
many similar operations going through the decades. It didn't it didn't suddenly start in there. When
was the Franklin scandal in the 1980s 90s late. It was in the 80s. Yeah. And then put up in the
early 90s. I mean I can't believe that it wasn't also happening in the 40s and the 30s and the
20s. Yeah. I mean child trafficking isn't something new. But with the Franklin network
and also with the Epstein network you've got pinhole cameras. And it's very easy to provide
compromise on people. So the technology has changed. And it's much easier to compromise people.
So what you mean these these pinhole cameras were installed in the rooms where they're
yeah. And how how senior were the well the Franklin Franklin scandal first how what what
level of politician are we talking about here. I think senators congressmen
at least one person in the cabinet of George Herbert Walker Bush I think was a predator.
Well why stop at one. I mean everything I know about George H W Bush. I mean he was involved in
gun running. He was in charge of gun running pretty much with you know he'd be there at the airport
ready to greet the consignments. He he was instrumental in all kinds of activities which
involve terrible things happening. So he at one point was the head of the CIA.
So no I I think that he did many evil things. But what I know is that I believe that at least
one person in his cabinet a high ranking cabinet member was a pedophile.
What can you name him. His name is Richard Thornberg. He was the attorney general.
Right. So the guy in charge of the law system. Yes. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I mean you've got
just skip skipping forward a second. You've got on the flight log on the Epstein Island flight
logs. You've got people from the Supreme Court haven't you. Okay. So
that I have not seen those flight logs. I mean it's rumored that there are people in
your window on the Supreme Court like John Roberts. But I have not seen those particular
flight logs. And with these documents you got to be very careful because some of them are
disinformation and some of them are misinformation. And I've stubbed my toe a couple of times on
these documents. So you got to tread very carefully when looking at a lot of these documents.
Yeah. I can see that. I mean I can see well given that the organizations like the CIA
are going to be in it up to the neck both in terms of actually participating in these
disgusting activities and profiting by them but also in the cover up. Inevitably there's going to
be lots of misinformation and disinformation out there. I totally get that. So how do you work
out what's kosher and what is chaff? Well you have to investigate. You got to be very
you know as I said early on I stubbed my toe on this and because I jumped on some documents
it was before I realized that the documents could be problematic.
So corroboration is helpful. I make phone calls. Yeah but you can't you can't just
ring up I don't know Tom Cruise and say Tom hey you're on the you're on the flight log.
Did you go out to St. Nicholas and James and abuse some kids?
Well actually I've rung up a number of people that were involved with Epstein that are very
that have high status in society. So yeah I followed up a lot of it. None of them have
gone back to me although Epstein's brother didn't get back to me. His brother. Yeah.
What's his name?
Epstein's brother is Mark Epstein. Right. Is he a nice guy? Is he like his brother?
Well there's an email where he's asking Epstein about the gynecologist that Epstein used for his
court on court victims because apparently he needs a gynecologist. So I asked him about that.
And he wasn't. He did return my email though. He's the only one that's returned an email. So why?
Why did he return the email? Yeah I have no idea. You'd have to ask him.
But I mean that's like the serial killer wanting to get court isn't it?
Well he just denied it and said that he only talks about his brother's death to journalists.
So I started another email. He never got back to me.
You don't think Epstein's dead do you?
If I had to put money on it I would say that he was dead. Yeah. Would you?
Yeah. I think I'd be happy to take that bet with you.
So you saw the terror and the pedophile formerly known as Prince Andrew's eyes when he was arrested.
You know the picture I'm talking about? Yeah but I imagine that's the terror
of a man who gets... No let me fix my thumb on it. Okay. All right.
So there was a guy who thought he was above the law.
And he would be unscathed by the law and he got arrested.
Now if you look at the picture of Epstein when he was arrested I think his
continence shows the same type of emotions about a guy who felt he was above the law
that he was arrested nonetheless.
Or my take on both those cases would be okay. So you're living a fabulously glitzy lifestyle
private chefs and young girls on demand according to your boys, according to your taste on demand
and you fly in private jets and stuff and you realise that for a period you are going to have to
go through the motions of being somebody who's been apprehended by the law and going through the law.
All the goodies, the taps providing the goodies are going to be turned off for a while
because that's the way it is and it's all part of the charade.
I just don't think that given how high level the people involved in this work and given the
usefulness of Epstein to so many of the powers that be, I think his reward was to be to be
scooted off and sent to a nice suburb of Tel Aviv and get his new private life.
Well, that is within the realm of possibility. I don't deny that. I look at the two pimps in
the Franklin scandal. The guy in Omaha was Lawrence King and the guy in Washington,
D.C. was Craig Spetz and they're somewhat analogous to Maxwell and Epstein. Maxwell built a machine
that scooped up little girls and Epstein flew them around, did the logistics, blackmailed people,
when Craig Spetz and King got started to get a lot of media and once you get media,
if you're a blackmailer, that's pretty much the end of it. You're no longer going to be
useful as a blackmailer. Once people read about what you're doing, that's it. And then
with Epstein, there were civil suits being launched at him and also that Miami Herald
series that outed him as a predator and that was in 218 and he was arrested in 219. Now with
King and Spence, the Franklin pimps, Spence did commit suicide. It's speculated that he was
suicided. I do not believe that. He checked into the Boston Ritz-Carlton in a tuxedo and
took an overdose of no-triptyline and he had an article next to his body about
CIA agents or assets being called to testify before government bodies because he had been subpoenaed
by a grand jury and I think that it was a deal was made with him that either because Craig Spence
lived the high life. I mean, he lived like Epstein. He lived the high life and he was a power broker.
I don't think he could have made it in jail. I just don't think he could have made it in jail
and he couldn't have kept his mouth shut. So I believe that there was a deal that was made with
him either you can kill yourself or we can kill you. Flipside, Maxwell and Epstein, I think Epstein
had grown too fond of creature comforts and there was way too much media on him.
So he had to be taken out. Now, I believe that Maxwell made a deal like Lawrence King made a deal.
If you keep your mouth shut, you'll be incarcerated for a while but we'll take
care of you when you get out and Lawrence King had a no-show job at a BMW dealership
when he got out of prison after 10 years or 12 years and he wasn't indicted on a single
kind of child abuse. He was indicted for embezzling 40 million dollars from the fray on Pratt. So I
think that those two situations are pretty analogous. Right. Is he still alive? He is.
Does he get any appropriate? Does he get any grief from anyone? Well, he extremely gets a lot
of grief for me. He tries to unveil himself into groups that would give him access to children.
And I've gotten him kicked out of three of those groups. So scale. Yeah. That's some
hoodspot, isn't it? He's a predator. Yeah. I mean, they don't, a guy like that,
a guy like Jeffrey Epstein, a guy like Lawrence King, they're addicted to molesting children.
I mean, it's an addiction to that. And yeah, they just don't stop.
What's your impression about all the kind of the, the, the clientele that came to
Little St. James? I mean, are they in it because they actually like having sex with,
with children? Or do you think they're doing it because
everyone else is doing it and it's part of the kind of the mutual sort of mutually
assured, compromise, destruction system in which they operate? Or is it, is it occultic? What?
So when I was investigating the Franklin scale, I got to a black mouth photographer.
That's how deep I got into that network. I got to a black mouth doctor.
And there's no books about this. Well, now there is because I wrote one, but prior to that,
there was no books about this. And I was trying to get my mind around it because it was so big
and the coverup was so massive. And how did it work? And I posed that question to the black
mouth photographer and he said, once you're compromised, it's like you're on a yacht.
And it's a beautiful yacht and it's a beautiful day. And you can have anything you want on the
yacht. But if you decide to get off the yacht, the people on the yacht are going to make sure
that you drop. So there's zero incentive to get off the yacht. And actually, if you're on the
yacht, you're going to experience upward mobility in your, as a politician, earning your trust.
Do you know what, Nick? I think that is my favorite analogy that describes the process.
That's absolutely. I think it's the best one out there.
It is. It explains so much. It explains. It explains the music industry. I mean,
look at P. Diddy. Have you looked into those at all? The P. Diddy parties? They must be some
big time. Yes. That that was kind of the rap rap Epstein. Wasn't it really?
Yeah. I mean, the fact that he only got four years was kind of mind-boggling to me.
Because he was also trafficking minors for sexual purposes.
Yeah. But am I not right in thinking that the equivalent of the yacht in the Diddy parties was
basically if you wanted a career in music, first of all, you had to be sodomized by
Diddy and about five of his associates, and then kind of you were on the yacht
till the next sodomy session, probably. Well, once you're on the yacht, sometimes it isn't always
smooth sailing, but you're going to have a great career and get what you want out of life.
And there are a lot of people like that, that are willing to do whatever it takes
for stardom because they think that they're going to receive the love that they were never
given as children. I think that that is a strong motivating factor for seeking stardom.
Yeah. But didn't you, I mean, I don't know how old you are, Nick. How old are you, if I may ask?
That's kind of an impertinent question. Okay. I'll ask you then. I'm 60.
Okay. And when I was a young man, if you'd come up to me and said, James, do you want to be,
do you want to be a rock star? I thought, yeah, I'm like, I get to play with my axe on stage,
and I get to be maybe Jimmy Page and have loads and loads of sex with loads and loads of girls
and loads of drugs and a big house and a big house and another big house in the country.
I'd have gone, yeah, what's not to lie?
But now I look at that and I realize that's not, that's not the deal. Those are the good,
that's the fun, the room service on the yacht and the cocktail party, but it doesn't describe the
whole thing. When you make a Faustian pack, there are always clauses that are in the
fine print that you don't read. Yeah. Yeah. Do you, is it your, I mean, I'm probably straying away from
your field of expertise here because I know that you're the sort of person who likes verifiable
facts and I'm asking you to speculate here, but do you think anyone achieves eminence in that
industry without making that pact? I believe that there are some. Yeah, I do.
Wow. How I, I, I've known rock stars over the years that have made it to the top because of their
talent without making a Faustian pack. Global warming is a massive con. There was no evidence whatsoever
that manmade climate change is a problem that is going to kill us, that we need to amend our
lifestyle in order to deal with it. It's an non-existent problem. But how do you explain
this stuff to your normie friends? Well, I've just brought out the revised edition of my 2012
classic book, Watermelons, which captures the story of how some really nasty people
decided to invent the global warming scare in order to fleece you, to take away your freedoms,
to take away your land. It's a shocking story. I wrote it, as I say, in, well, 2011 actually,
the first edition came out. And it's a snapshot of a particular era, the era when the people
behind the climate change scan got caught red-handed, tinkering with the data,
torturing till it screamed in a scandal that I helped christen Climategate. So I give you
the background to the sculled jugglery that went on in these seats of learning where these supposed
experts were informing us, we've got to act now. I rumbled their scan. I then asked the question,
okay, if it is a scan, who's doing this and why? It's a good story. I've kept the original
book pretty much as is, but I've written two new chapters, one at the beginning and one at the
end, explaining how it's even worse than we thought. I think it's a good, I think it still
stands out. I think it's a good read. Obviously I'm biased, but I'd recommend it. You can buy it from
JamesDellingPoll.co.uk forward slash shop. You'll probably find that, like, just go to my
website and look for it, JamesDellingPoll.co.uk. And I hope it helps keep you informed and
gives you the material you need to bring around all those people who are still persuaded that,
oh, it's a disaster. We must amend our ways and appease the gods, appease Mother Earth.
Merry day. It's a scam.
Wow, how? I've known rock stars over the years that have made it to the top because of their
talent without making a frosty impact. Well, not every rock star is compromised.
I'm a massive fan of Johnny Cash, and part of me cannot think of Johnny Cash having taken
shit from anybody. But at the same time, I know from his latter recordings that here was a man
whose conscience was deeply troubled, and he knew he'd signed a pact, a terrible pact,
and he kind of wanted to get out of that pact, which is why he embraced Jesus.
And you see, it infuses all his songs, all his last songs made for American recordings.
So even Johnny Cash, who strikes me as a man who had considerable integrity,
had clearly done some terrible shit.
Yeah, I mean, he had a problem with drugs and alcohol, and that type of lifestyle is going to
cause, you're going to engage in behaviors that you otherwise wouldn't engage in.
Yeah. The point I was sort of hinting at earlier was that you are, you strike me
as an investigative journalist of the old school. You're the kind of investigative
reporter they don't make anymore. You said yourself, you actually got on the phone
and rang up the people on the Epstein list, even though you kind of knew they weren't going,
but that's the kind of reporter you are. Whereas I'm coming at this stuff from a completely the
other end in that I was a mainstream media journalist, not an investigative reporter,
and then I went down the rabbit hole for various reasons about five or six years ago.
And I went on the Fast Track program, so I've spent a lot of time diving into all sorts of
crazy places. And up to and including talking to people involved in ritual Satanism and
Mothers of Darkness, MK Ultra, Monarch Victims, Assassins and so on.
And it seems to me, looking at the Epstein files that the idea that this was a sort of
Compromat network trading underage girls for politicians and celebrities,
that's just the tip of the iceberg. You get hints of this in the various
documents which have been revealed to us, even though they've been redacted.
The stuff, for example, about jerky. I mean, you don't surely think that that is just
CIA disinfo. This is real, right?
I don't know. I've concluded Muffins are Freud. His thing was phallic symbols. And someone asked
Freud, don't you think cigars are phallic symbols? And he said sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
And Freud is one of them. Freud was heavily compromised by the system.
So I think that in this case, a muffin is just a muffin. And a steak is just a steak.
I've got a PowerPoint in which I show people the various emails, how I conclude that.
Now, I don't, I think pizza is a code word. And I hate to be even
minutely affiliated with Pizzagate because that spawned a lot of insanity. But
there's a lot of talk about pizza with some very unsavory characters. So I haven't really
gotten into jerky yet. I've been focused on other parts of emails. So I haven't looked at jerky
yet. I think you wouldn't want to get into Pizzagate for the same reason you don't want to
start doing investigative stories about the Clintons because it doesn't seem to have a
happy ending for people who get involved in that kind of thing. I mean, wasn't that why
Andrew Breitbart got suicide or got heart attacked? I don't know. And when I started
investigating this realm with the first death threat, I knew that there was a possibility
that these investigations could lead to my demise. But I was cool with it. If I'm going to get killed
doing this, trying to expose child molestation, I'm cool with that. I don't have a problem with it.
If I got killed because I was blackmailing someone or I committed some kind of crime,
I wouldn't be cool with that. But with this, and how I've been able to keep my sanity over the years
are one of the major reasons why I've been able to... I know what I'm doing with this is absolutely right.
And very seldom in life do you know it's absolutely right. You know you shouldn't
steal. You know you shouldn't lie. You know you shouldn't commit adultery.
You generally know what you shouldn't do. But very seldom in life do you know exactly what you should do.
I had sushi last night for dinner. Was that the absolute right thing to do? I don't know.
But this is the absolute right thing to do. So that's given me a lot of Alice.
I suppose your mercury levels will have increased as a result of the sushi.
Well actually I'm pretty healthy for a guy my age.
By the way, can I retract my rude question? It was only...
You're looking good, Nick. However old you are.
Yeah, I mean do you... Because obviously I've had to think about this as well.
My sister said to me... My sister was down the rabbit hole way before I was.
And said to me, Jay, I really don't want you to start
satisfying your curiosity because it's going to get you killed.
And so I had that same... Oh, what am I getting into here?
But do you believe in the afterlife? I do. I don't think that this is the only dancer is.
Absolutely. And actually I was in the Epstein files myself.
When I was calling... When I got Epstein's black book I started calling his inner circle.
And only one person picked up it was Sarah Kellan who is a nasty piece of work, one of the
henchwomen that led hundreds of girls to the slaughter. And she told me that the media had
always been mean to her. And I thought that that was somewhat comedic. She wanted me to commiserate
with her and I was unwilling to do that. But then there was an email sent from...
We don't know because that was redacted. Sent to Epstein's entire inner circle
talking about a journalist named Nick Bryant that's down here asking questions and to be
aware of them. And they even had my picture on the email.
So they were very much aware of me when I started to investigate Epstein's story.
And I could tell Epstein was very angry when I published the black book if you look at the
emails. Ghislaine Maxwell told him that we'd published the black book. And you can tell
that Epstein wasn't cool with it because of a later email with Peter Thiel. So
Peter Thiel was trying to sue Glocker and Oblivion and Epstein said he'd share the expanses.
Yeah, I mean I'm obviously not shocked to hear this now about Peter Thiel.
But there was a time when I thought, okay, so Zuckerberg is obviously a wrong man and
whoever the other... Yeah, I mean Bill Gates is obviously wrong. And I thought Peter Thiel was
somehow... Because doesn't he sort of flirt with pretending to be a Christian or something?
Peter Thiel is probably... He's one of the worst of them all.
Is he?
Tell me more. I mean, he's palantir, isn't he?
Yeah. Which is, okay, QED. But anything else you can tell me about him?
Well, Google Peter Thiel and there's a lot of information about him out there. I don't
want to get into it, but I'll let your audience make their own conclusions.
I'd be willing Peter Thiel and young Matt and our young boys.
Oh, right. Yes, of course, young men, young boys. Bill Gates, I was grossed out to learn,
named his yacht after some sort of part of the female anatomy, some sort of horrible
pun or something, gory something. Do you know about this one?
Bill Gates? No.
Yeah. Well, it's been very heavily... They're very good at scrubbing the internet, but the name of Bill
Bill Gates' yacht is some grotesque pun on the female anatomy. It begins gory, but I can't
remember... I can't remember what because I haven't come across this word before. I mean,
some of the incidental detail is, when you said earlier on, you said when you were first releasing
this stuff, when was it? Well, I got it. I got the Black Book in 2011, and I got the Flight Logs
in 2014, but nobody wanted to touch it in the mainstream media who I pitched it to,
and ultimately, Glocker published it in 2015. And got shut down for the punishment?
Well, they were sued into oblivion for something completely different.
Yes, exactly. But we know. And the person financing that lawsuit was Peter Thiel.
Peter Thiel put an open contract out on Glocker because Glocker outed him as gay, and he wanted
vengeance. On the subject of the little Black Book, because one of my old friends is in it,
it's presumably, I mean, loads of people, completely innocent could be in the Black Book.
Yes. How did you get hold of it? An attorney for one of the victims gave it to me.
Well, you had the physical book in your hand. Well, I had a copy of the physical book.
Well, you had sort of photocopies kind of thing. Yeah.
Right, right. Okay. So, I mean, apart from being able to say you were the first to grab
this Black Book, and how significant or not significant is it in the scheme of things?
In our understanding of Epstein, I think there's been three quantum leaps.
I think the first quantum leap was me pulling up the Black Book and the flight logs.
I think the second quantum leap was Julie Bronze Articles and the Miami Herald.
And I think the third quantum leap is the tranche of emails that have just been released.
So, I do believe that me putting the Black Book and flight logs up was the first
quantum leap in our understanding of Jeffrey Epstein.
And do you think it would have been possible to go on the private jet to
Little St. James and be pure as driven snow and you go out there just to have a nice holiday
in the sun with no underage boys or girls to have sex with?
Well, everyone who has gone to Little St. James has said that.
So, it must be true.
Are you having fun?
I just can't buy it somehow. I just can't imagine. You couldn't sort of accidentally go
to Little St. James thinking that Jeffrey Epstein was just a kind of
unusually generous host. You had to know what the deal was, surely?
I don't think that you would have to hang out with Jeffrey Epstein very long to really understand
what exactly he was. He was a pedophilic pimp and he wore it on his sleeve.
He didn't have a problem with it. He had no
moral compunction whatsoever about being a pedophilic pimp and a child molester.
He had no compunction. Have you met him?
He was a straight-up psychopath.
Have you met him?
Yeah.
I listened to the first time today, the first time the other day,
some recordings of him actually speaking. There was an interview that Steve Bannon did with him.
And he didn't sound at all like I would expect Jeffrey Epstein, I mean, to sound.
And I think for most of us, our experience of Jeffrey Epstein has been
photographs of that sort of annoying. There's something really annoying about his face.
He seems sort of quite conventionally good-looking, but there's something about his
expressions which are just like they creep you out slightly.
Well, I mean, the guy was a psychopath and it's kind of hard to hide that sometimes.
Sometimes a lot of times psychopaths can, but a lot of times things
eke out of their personality or things that they say.
But psychopaths can often be very charming, can't they?
Definitely.
And is that the case with Epstein?
I believe so, yeah.
Right. So all those kind of intimate emails shared between Peter Mandelson and Epstein.
I mean, Mandelson seems half in love with Epstein.
Yes. Mandelson and Jeffrey Epstein were very, very close, one can tell.
I think that they shared various predilections together.
And it's unfortunate that Mandelson has only been arrested for giving Epstein insider financial
information because he should be arrested for some other things, too.
Well, yeah. I mean, Epstein was girls. Mandelson obviously would have been boys,
for preference.
Who do you think was running Epstein?
And yeah, who was running him?
I think that there's a dark malignant corner of intelligence, U.S. intelligence and Israeli
intelligence that does this type of thing, compromises people.
I don't see how people can really debate me on that.
And people think that Epstein was exclusively Mossad.
There's been a number of emails between Ahud Barak and Epstein in which they're setting up arms
deals by going to people that run armaments factories or companies in Israel and elsewhere
who have also been high ranking Israeli intelligence.
And Ahud Barak was head of Israeli intelligence, domestic intelligence.
What's in that?
Yeah. So with, as you'll say to me, it was at the Mossad.
And I invariably respond, Epstein very well could have been working with the Mossad.
But I find it hard to believe that the CIA would let the Mossad compromise American politicians
on American soil and not get a cut of that intelligence.
I think, I look at the Gambino, I look at the CIA and the Mossad, they're like the
Gambino and Genovese crime families. They were together.
Yeah. And under my six, presumably, also.
Yeah. Yes.
So they would be the Luchesi.
Luchesi, Colombo or Bonanno, one of the three.
Isn't that good that we've all got our own countries have their
intelligence services that we can be truly proud of?
Right. Yeah, yeah. I get that. But in terms of the money, I've heard
Les Wexner. And then, of course, in the emails, Epstein says, I'm representative of the Rothschilds.
So is, I mean, Les Wexner is not a nice guy, is he?
No. He's a nasty piece of work. And he lied before the oversight committee a couple of weeks
ago. He should be indicted for perjury before Congress.
What did he lie on?
He said that the last communication he had with Jeffrey Epstein was 2006,
when there's emails from 2008. And also, Jeffrey Epstein gave him $56 million in 2011.
So obviously, they were dealing with each other after 2006. And he should be indicted for that.
$56 million. Yes.
At this point, it's an oversight. It's small change to these people.
So, he lied before Congress, and that's a five-year and or $250,000 fund.
But, Nick, I was going to ask you this. Isn't one of the purposes of this Epstein
document mass release, isn't the true purpose of it to make us so dispirited with the system
that we don't know where to turn? So we're kind of planet struck by this information.
We've got everything. Well, you're not convinced by the beef jerky thing,
where I probably more am. But you've got-
I haven't looked into it yet.
Right. Okay. But anyone looking at this stuff is going to be saying,
these people are above the law. There is no justice because all the judges are in on it.
And the cops, as you demonstrated way back in Franklin, are in on it.
The politicians are all compromised. What hope is there for any of us?
We started an organization called Epstein Justice. It's a 501C3, and I urge your audience to go to
EpsteinJustice.com. And what we're lobbying for is an independent congressional commission.
An independent congressional commission does not require the signature of the president.
It does require a majority in the House and a Senate. And independent congressional
commissions often incorporate non-government personnel to carry out investigations.
And that's the only way we're going to get truth here, is if we have non-government personnel
as part of the investigation. And that's what Epstein Justice is lobbying for. And
I would suggest that your audience check us out at EpsteinJustice.com.
I think it's a noble cause, but I'm thinking, I can't remember, actually,
there's, I think there's two of the Psalms where God looks to find some good men on earth.
And it says, no, not one. And I mean, you discovered way back in the Franklin scandal,
if they're getting congressmen, if they're compromised, if they're on the kind of the
proto-Epstein love boat. How are you going to find people that are not tainted? Because it seems to
be everywhere. We have started Facebook groups by state. And we are building a critical mass
to put as much pressure on those representatives and federal legislators as possible.
And as we get more, we can start putting pressure on more and more and more. And actually, we supported
a Epstein protest in Sacramento, California over the weekend. So we are a grassroots movement.
There are no billionaires helping us. There are no millionaires helping us. But I think that
Americans really want the right thing with this case. And there are three
trends that are, that hurt Americans right now, as far as getting at the truth. Americans are
heavily polarized between right and left. That's a function of our media and our government.
People on the left think people on the right are mentally ill, people on the
right think people on the left are mentally ill. So Americans have been divided and conquered.
And the second trend is Americans have been conditioned to think that they cannot affect change.
That their government is just a runaway juggernaut and they can't do anything about it.
And I think the third trend is, many of our legislators are blackmailed. But we can
take back the first two trends. Because if anything is going to unite the right and the left,
it's going to be the government covering up child trafficking,
eating and betting child trafficking. If anything is going to mobilize people,
it's going to be the government eating and betting child trafficking.
Yeah. But we get these sort of drip releases. Don't we? There was that movie that came out
a couple of years ago about child trafficking. And I don't know whether you looked into it,
but there was something slightly dodgy about this film that it wasn't...
Are you attracting sound of freedom?
Yeah, yeah.
It was a good film about trafficking. Unfortunately, Tim Baller, who the film was about, is...
He's not a very good guy.
Very tactfully put. I was waiting for you to say something a bit stronger.
But yeah, that was kind of what I... So what I mean is you're familiar with the concept
of flooding the zone, aren't you?
Yes.
Isn't that slightly what's been going on?
So I'm very familiar with flooding the zone.
You what, so I said that again?
I played college football.
Oh, football. So I'm very familiar with flooding the zone.
Sorry. I don't know anything about football, either English soccer or American football.
So maybe you can just... I'm only familiar with the kind of the CIA use of that phrase.
What does it mean in football?
In football, it means putting more office of players in an area than there are defense players.
Oh, okay. Yeah.
And in metaphorical terms, it's usage in intelligence circles.
How would you describe how it works?
Well, right now, we've got the surfeit of documents, $3 million or $3.5 million.
There's a lot of redactions.
And people that should be lobbying for justice are going down rabbit holes.
And I see that longtime activists who I would think would really want to help
have seen justice would rather go down rabbit holes.
And that's unfortunate.
And that's what happens when the zone gets flooded is people opt to go down rabbit holes
than to describe for justice.
So if I understand you, the CIA and all the kind of the Mossad and all the bad,
the cabal, the elites, they kind of really want people like me to be getting excited about beef
jerky or about satanic stuff because it it distracts our attention away from the kind of the
more basic stuff of bringing these people to justice.
Yes.
Yeah. Yeah.
But I suppose I suppose in the defense of kind of tinfoil hat lunatics like myself,
there is there isn't even even bigger picture.
I mean, for example, can I ask you about the Ross Childs who I can't imagine
you're going to be approaching to support your campaign?
They're not going to I mean, they could afford it.
But I just if you ask them, I don't think they're going to give you any money, are they?
I wouldn't have to say that there would be a low probability of getting money from the
rock. Yeah.
But it'd be quite it'd be quite game of them if they did.
I mean, OK, we've less waxed now.
The guy who went what were his clothing companies?
The one Victoria's Secret, Abercrombie Fitch, Abercrombie and Fitch.
You see, I'm I'm young enough or old enough to remember
when when Abercrombie and Fitch invaded the UK.
And it was the my children were just the right age to want to go and buy Abercrombie and Fitch
clothes. And everyone wanted to get a job as one of their kind of the young men that they
had selling clothes in their shops. And they have sort of posing and pouting and stuff.
It's it's really interesting to know that the guy behind that outfit and Victoria's Secret was this
gangster, basically, wasn't he, the kind of Jewish mafia, I suppose.
Search up with the Italian mafia.
There seems to be a sort of crime ink was the Jewish mafia and the Italian mafia, right?
There's been an overlap, for sure, over the year.
But OK, so I don't I don't whether this is this is an area of interest to you or not.
But I I've noticed in the Epstein releases that there's a lot of stuff about Epstein himself
is very dismissive about the Goyim. There are all sorts of disparaging reference to the Goy.
And then you've got the stuff about the Rothschilds, basically.
Him being representing the Rothschilds.
There seems to be seems to be a thing going on in America, particularly where people are noticing
anti anti let's call it anti Goyim activity by by the Jewish power structure.
And I was wondering whether you thought that this was a deliberate part of the operation.
It seems to me that if you look at it in sort of grand conspiracy terms,
one of the requirements for Armageddon is that the world turns against Israel.
So that because that's where Armageddon is going to happen.
Am I imagining this or is there a kind of an increasing amount of noticing going on in
America about Jewish influence, Jewish cynicism towards Goy's?
America overall is very pro-Jewish or pro-Ado.
It has been up until now. I'm just wondering whether the climate is changing slightly.
This is an undercurrent of anti-Semitism also in America that's been there a long time.
But as far as delineating Gog and Magog, I don't know where would even begin to start there.
Right. That's what I'm I'm always looking for the
look. I'm of the view and I suspect you probably share this up to a point that
the media is a lie machine. I mean, good writers like yourself get in by accident rather than
they don't really want good people doing doing good stuff.
I imagine that your your your mainstream career pretty much died when you started exposing stuff
like Franklin. So what I'm suggesting is the fact that all the Epstein files are now in the
public domain in the kind of crappy newspapers that that ordinary people read suggests to me
that on some level this is shit that they want to come out. This is a other controlled release
or flooding the zone or whatever. It's another stage in their plan. Would you agree with that?
Well, the Trump administration fought very, very, very, very hard to ensure that no
documents came out. And when the Trump administration realized it was going to lose
then all the Republicans voted for except for one in the House and all for the Senate.
And then the tranche of documents came out. Unfortunately, the Trump administration
isn't living up to the letter of the law because the Epstein transparency act is a law.
It's going to be a law in 10 years. It's going to be a law in 15 years
unless it gets retracted. So the Trump administration has been breaking the law
with its release of these Epstein documents.
That how has it been breaking the law?
Because there needs to be a lot more documents released.
On redaction, I imagine.
There needs to be a lot less redaction. Sure. Yeah.
You say that they fought it hard, but they realized they couldn't stop it happening.
What who were the good guys in this then who who who who who ensured that justice was done?
Thomas Massey of Kentucky and Ro Khanna of California were the spearhead of this.
Right. And those two refused to back down. They're great guys.
And by the way, they support Epstein justice too.
Right. Okay.
A 501 C3.
So you reckon it was going to be, had it not been for them,
Trump would have been able to keep this stuff under wraps?
I believe so.
How how implicated is Trump in this in this stuff?
Well, his name has come up a number of times.
But again, there's no Department of Justice or FBI investigation into any of this.
The department of justice. No, will it be surely.
The Department of Justice and the FBI have said that Epstein and Maxwell have no co-conspirators.
And everybody knows that's a lie.
Yeah. And they're going to that's why we need an independent congressional commission.
Right. I mean, look,
as I understand it, the the CIA is a gun running organization, the drug trafficking
organization. That's that's how it gets it. It's it's it's black budget, basically.
And it doesn't work for the US taxpayer. It works for the shadowy forces that
I call them the cabal or the rulers of the darkness of this world.
I'm assuming that the FBI is just as compromised in its way.
Yes. But I'll say this. There are good people at the CIA and there are good people in the FBI.
How do they not get killed?
I would I was given
information for the Franklin scandal by a couple of feds.
That if they've been busted, giving me that information, they surely would have been fired.
But they saw what after doing was noble, plus I had some information that they wanted.
So they gave me really good information that I wouldn't have been able to get any other way.
And that shows that there are good people in both these organizations.
But the thing is, they're both tainted at the top.
With Kashpatel, with the FBI and Pam Bondi with the DOJ, they are very tainted people.
They are here to cover up Epstein. They are nasty, vicious
people. Yes. Which tells you all you need to know about the level of the extent to which
this corruption has penetrated the system. And that would surely suggest that Trump is part of that.
Well, it's been the Trump administration that's fought this the whole way.
And Pam Bondi and Kashpatel are getting their marching orders from Trump. So,
yes. But that's a reasonable surmise. I'll tell you what, slightly
worries me about the whole. I've got to take off that in a few, okay?
Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you not think there's, to some degree,
it's a damage limitation exercise? So, as I understand it, the sort of,
if you asked a sort of ordinary member of the public, despite all this documently,
what their take home from this is, they'd say, yeah, well, Prince Andrew slept with that 17-year-old
girl. And yes, Epstein was clearly trafficking young girls for exploitation by these famous people.
But at the same time, you've got, you've got a frazzled rib.
Like, way worse things happen, where you've got Hillary Clinton tearing off the face of a child
that's just about being slaughtered and putting it on her face. Do you know what I mean?
I don't need to say that definitively. I don't know who it is.
That's the reporter in you, whereas I'm a kind of conspiracy nutcase. But I think I'm right.
In a way, if we keep this stuff in the realm of responsible reporting, which is basically what
you do, we're in danger of letting the really, really, really bad stuff off the hook.
There's really, really bad stuff that I've reported on that's horrific.
That's corroborated. So, or the email that I'm showing, like, there was the billionaire from
United Arab Emirates that sent Epstein a video. And Epstein wrote back, I loved the torture video.
There are definitive examples like that.
But that guy's never going to be indicted, the Arab shake.
Well, he lost his job, but yeah. But it shows how evil these people are.
Okay.
That email shows how evil these people are.
But do you think any, I mean, do you, in your heart of hearts, do you think any big names are
going to, heads are going to roll over this ever?
Well, a lot of big names have come out, including Les Wexner as perpetrators.
So.
But he, but he purged himself and got away with it.
It's up to us as Americans. Really. It's up to us as Americans.
Whether or not we're going to let our government get away with this.
Thank you. You've got to go, Nick. Thank you. Tell me, tell us where we can find your staff,
where we can read you.
I would suggest to go to Epsteinjustice.com. If you're interested in any of my books,
you can go to nickbrinenyc.com. But please go to Epsteinjustice.com and we need donations.
So, and I realize your audience is from the UK, but we still need donations. So
that's where you can find us.
Great. Thank you very much. Enjoy the rest of your New York day.
Okay. Thank you.
Thanks a lot. Are you